# Saint Louis PM or GM as a first tote: capacity, shoulder drop and the pouch **URL:** \ **Category:** Newbie Corner\ **Tags:** question\ **Created:** [October 21, 2026, 1:20am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286 "2026-10-21T01:20:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![handle\_notes](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/handle_notes/32/291_2.png) [@handle\_notes](https://superreps.net/u/handle_notes)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:20am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/1 "2026-10-21T01:20:38Z")
A frequent first-tote question: Saint Louis PM or GM? Let’s do it step by step, since version comparisons are already covered in the [French Saint Louis thread](https://superreps.net/fr/t/goyard-saint-louis-comparer-versions-sans-noms-usines/149). Here it’s only about size and use. 1. What fits in each? 2. How do they sit on the shoulder? 3. How do they soften over time? 4. What’s the pouch actually for? “Drop” here means the distance from the top of the handle to the top of the bag. There is more detail in [First bag: Speedy, Neverfull, or something else](https://superreps.net/t/first-bag-speedy-neverfull-or-something-else-how-do-people-actually-decide/152). Related threads: [Coated canvas or leather for your first rep bag](https://superreps.net/t/coated-canvas-or-leather-for-your-first-rep-bag-which-one-is-more-forgiving/247). ---
**Author:** ![tote\_geek](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/tote_geek/32/296_2.png) [@tote\_geek](https://superreps.net/u/tote_geek)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:20am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/2 "2026-10-21T01:20:39Z")
- PM: the everyday size. Wallet, phone, a book, a light jacket, a small laptop in some cases - GM: noticeably bigger. A larger laptop, a change of clothes, shopping - Both are open-top; there’s no zip, only the centre hook - The common mistake: choosing GM “for extra space”, then finding it shapeless when half empty ---
**Author:** ![shoulderbagradar](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/shoulderbagradar/32/297_2.png) [@shoulderbagradar](https://superreps.net/u/shoulderbagradar)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:20am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/3 "2026-10-21T01:20:41Z")
Pros and cons. PM - Pro: sits neatly under the arm; holds its shape better when partly full. - Con: tighter for laptops and bulky items. GM - Pro: real capacity for heavy days and travel. - Con: the body hangs lower against the hip, and the handles take more weight. With heavy loads the thin handles dig into the shoulder. On drop: the handles are similar, so the bigger GM body sits lower on the body and feels longer. ---
**Author:** ![pouch\_buff](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/pouch_buff/32/301_2.png) [@pouch\_buff](https://superreps.net/u/pouch_buff)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:20am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/4 "2026-10-21T01:20:42Z")
Verdict first: use the pouch. It’s the solution to the open top. Details: the zip pouch attaches inside, or carries on its own as a small clutch. Keys, cards and small items go in it, so they don’t sink to the bottom of an open tote. Most reports say people end up using it daily. ---
**Author:** ![handle\_notes](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/handle_notes/32/291_2.png) [@handle\_notes](https://superreps.net/u/handle_notes)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:20am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/5 "2026-10-21T01:20:44Z")
And softening over time? Some people say the canvas gets floppy. ---
**Author:** ![thriftytote](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/thriftytote/32/307_2.png) [@thriftytote](https://superreps.net/u/thriftytote)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:21am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/6 "2026-10-21T01:21:01Z")
If you only care about a crisp look, then the PM is the better choice: the canvas is soft and unstructured by design, and it softens more with use. The GM, with more fabric and more weight inside, slumps sooner. If you want structure, some people use a bag organiser insert. The [canvas or leather thread](https://superreps.net/t/first-rep-bag-coated-canvas-or-leather/247) explains how coated canvas ages. ---
**Author:** ![tote\_geek](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/tote_geek/32/296_2.png) [@tote\_geek](https://superreps.net/u/tote_geek)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:21am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/7 "2026-10-21T01:21:02Z")
- Comparing with other laptop totes? The [Anjou vs OnTheGo thread](https://superreps.net/t/goyard-anjou-vs-lv-onthego-laptop-tote-rep/261) covers that use - For laptops, measure the laptop and compare with the base width, not the top width; Saint Louis tapers ---
**Author:** ![handle\_notes](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/handle_notes/32/291_2.png) [@handle\_notes](https://superreps.net/u/handle_notes)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:21am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/8 "2026-10-21T01:21:03Z")
Thanks all. Summary, step by step: 1. **Capacity:** PM = everyday (wallet, phone, book, light layer; small laptops sometimes). GM = laptop, change of clothes, travel or shopping. 2. **On the shoulder:** similar handles, so the GM body sits lower against the hip; heavy loads make the thin handles dig in. 3. **Softening:** both are soft by design; the GM slumps sooner, especially half empty. An organiser insert helps. 4. **Pouch:** use it for keys, cards and small items, so they don’t sink in the open top. 5. **Laptop check:** measure against the base width, not the top; the shape tapers. **First tote:** the PM for most everyday use; the GM only if you regularly carry a laptop or extra clothing. Unsure between totes in general? The [Speedy vs Neverfull thread](https://superreps.net/t/first-bag-speedy-vs-neverfull-how-to-choose/152) uses the same method. [[PHOTO: example shots of Saint Louis-style PM and GM totes side by side on the shoulder, with the pouch shown beside each]] ---
**Author:** ![pouch\_buff](https://superreps.net/user_avatar/superreps.net/pouch_buff/32/301_2.png) [@pouch\_buff](https://superreps.net/u/pouch_buff)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2026, 1:21am UTC](https://superreps.net/t/saint-louis-pm-or-gm-as-a-first-tote-capacity-shoulder-drop-and-the-pouch/286/9 "2026-10-21T01:21:04Z")
PM plus pouch. Agreed.